About Thai Language

[MangoPin]

Just to say I am very impressed with those of you who learned how to speak thai, not to mention read and write. I stayed several years already, have a certain vocabulary but cannot really have any form of conversation. Two thais talking to each other or the TV is close to 0% understood.
I have my books (Thai for beginners, Learn Thai Easily: titles a joke). Pick them up sometimes but after a while its just a blur. Age does not help either. Maybe as a reaction to this i have started to get irritated with the construction of their "alphabet" and tones. Why couldnt they just make it readable left to right, not assume missing vowels, separate words. I guess its not their fault, I assume it comes from India and the grammar is of course easier.

I know the words below are correct but still...

กรุณา = garoonaa KH R A CH A (Where is the oo?) I have never heard this word. Is it used in spoken language?
ทำ = tahm TH A (Where is the m?)
ใหม่ = mai AI H M (Well...)

And on it goes...

And tones; klai=near kla-i=far Or the other way around, I never seem to get it right.

But I would very much like to learn this language, to be able to talk to my neighbors and friends. Evidently, and I believe it, you need to learn to read and write also to get it right. I have a plan to take lessons. I guess, for me this is a must, I am too lazy on my own. Any tips highly appreciated. How did you learn this alian language?

BTW. I heard some time agothat the african swahili (or lingala) word for today, tomorrow and yesterday is the same word. Well, could be true I guess...

MangoPin

[dozer]

Why couldnt they just make it readable left to right, not assume missing vowels, separate words. I guess its not their fault, I assume it comes from India and the grammar is of course easier.

As far as the missing vowels it is interesting to compare it to the written Lao language, which has fewer consonants and a different character set but the letters are a one to one substitution. The Thai/Lao dictionary is about 12 pages showing which Thai letters equate to which Lao letters, and thus if you can read Thai when you go to Lao you will be able to read it after a little while. (They obviously developed via a similar path but then each took its own way, since they are so similar.) However in the Lao language there are no assumed vowels, everything is spelled out completely. Somewhere in the past apparently in the Thai language they 'optimized' it to remove characters (ie. assumed vowels) there by making it more difficult to learn than one which hasn't be optimized such as Lao.

กรุณา = garoonaa KH R A CH A (Where is the oo?) I have never heard this word. Is it used in spoken language?

Yes although normally you see it written and not spoken.

ทำ = tahm TH A (Where is the m?)

The vowel is AM not A. The little circle on top makes it the sara am.

ใหม่ = mai AI H M (Well...)

The consonant sound comes before the vowel.

[Rick B]

The problem that most farangs have is that they try to learn Thai by using a book that phoneticizes the Thai words using the English alphabet. IMHO, the best way to learn to speak Thai, as well as read and write it, is to start immediately with learning the Thai alphabet, consonents and vowels, and the different tone marks. Then learn how to pronouce each word reading the Thai spelling, not the phoneticized spelling. This is the way all Thai children learn it, so why don't we all do the same? You also should learn to pronounce each word correctly when you initially learn it (i.e., using the proper tone). If you recognize the differences between the five tones in the Thai language, you wouldn't think that the Thai words for "near" and "far" are so very similar, because of the different tones used. Let's also not forget that most Thai people think learning to speak English is very hard. Do we think the same? No, because that is what we were raised on from our first days of life. Good luck!

[MangoPin]

Guess we are a bit off the topic but risk another post. Agree with you Rick although I believe books can be a good complement for getting some vocabulary. But surely there is a risk. I can do my mai mai mai mai mai, know their meaning and sounds perfect according to the missus. But later, one by one, I dont know which is which! Maybe by seeing these words transliterated makes me somehow think of them as five words spelled the same way. I know, even transliteraded with tone marks this might be a blocker. Perhaps when you learn to write and read you can actually learn to see that they are spelled differently and then learn their tone. Maybe this is exactly what you are saying. Anyway, its like quitting smoking, tomorrow...

I am from Sweden and english is not my first language. But its not the same when you start at 5 or 10 or at 50. For some its easier than for others. Learning a new language takes hard work and dicipline, I know, seldom comes automatically. But I will (re)start with my first five letters today and see where it takes me. Thanks for the tips and encouragement. Could I use my computer or is the sense of brain-hand-paper more efficient; to actually draw the characters? I would guess so. Any ideas? One advantage with all this is obviously that I will soon also be fluent in Lao

MangoPin